Isabel Rogers - Assistant TV Producer

In this podcast, the students are going to introduce you to Isabel Rogers who is an Assistant TV Producer for Wildstar Films. Isabel produces wildlife documentaries.

If you know a group of students who would like to interview female or non-binary role models, please get in touch by emailing podcast@untappedinnovation.com

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If you know a group of students who would like to interview one of our role models, please get in touch by emailing podcast@untappedinnovation.com

Likewise, if you know anyone who would be a great role model, let us know by emailing podcast@untappedinnovation.com

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Connect with us on LinkedIn @STEMUntappedCIC
Check out our website

Transcript

Intro 00:00

Hi, I'm Izzy, host of the STEM Untapped podcast. This week, our students are interviewing Isabel Rogers, who is an assistant producer for Wildstar films, and she produces wildlife documentaries.

Student Interviewers 00:17

I thought you were interesting, because I love animals. And I want to go into an animal degree myself when I'm older. So I thought by seeing your experience, and the way that you did things would help me in my pathway to getting there.

Isabel Rogers 00:31

Brilliant. Okay, sounds great. Nice to meet you.

Student Interviewers 00:34

When I saw yours, and they said Disney+, because I quite like Disney, like Disney stuff. Oh, that'd be quite interesting to learn about all like the behind the scenes and stuff. Like with animals, and I was like, because when I was younger, I wanted to be a vet. I like animals also. So it's not really sure I want to do once I leave school. So I thought listening to your experiences, and that could probably help me decide on like, if I want to do something with animals, or whether I want to do something else.

Isabel Rogers 01:02

So, I'm, I live in Bristol, in the UK. And that's basically mostly because of work because I work in the wildlife film industry, which is the hotspot is Bristol, in the world, actually, because that's where the BBC have their natural history unit. And so from that, there's multiple filmmakers have come stayed at the BBC but also left BBC and created independent companies, mostly focusing on wildlife documentary science. So that become a hub really, for the filmmakers. I've been doing it for about just over eight years, I suppose. I did a bit of conservation as well. And before that I did a degree. So it's been majority of my career. So currently, my title is Assistant Producer. And then that involves working in production, sort of in the office working in setting up productions or setting up series and films, setting up and directing on shoots, and then helping back in the edit when we get that back. So see, we end up having a lot of footage when we get back. And so it's quite a mixed job where you get to do research before, get to be on location in the field with wildlife, and then you have a lot of time in the edit or helping prep edit work before it goes out and you send to a broadcaster.

Student Interviewers 02:34

How would you introduce your STEM field to younger girls?

Isabel Rogers 02:38

Thinking about this is a nice crossover really, of science and technology in the sense that I started, you know, I did my degree in it was a BSc. So Bachelor of Science with the School of Wildlife Conservation. And so that involved three years of studying ecology, animal studies, also connections with people and the environment. And then moving into television has become much more having to learn a lot about technologies, both with camera gear, software for editing. And I think what's amazing is I just feel very lucky that I'm constantly learning in my job. And I think that's really something lucky. But it's also something maybe it's really interesting to strive for, when you're thinking about jobs where you can be doing something you enjoy, and it's challenging, but you're always able to learn new things. And you know, you feel you never really feel like you've learned everything. And I think that's what's really incredible about these subjects that gives you the opportunity to meet lots of people across those fields, and tie them in together science and technology

Student Interviewers 03:47

Was your job now, was it something you always knew you wanted to do? Or is it something that as you like, got older, you thought this seems interesting, I might do a club to like sign up and have a go at doing this while I'm in school?

Isabel Rogers 03:58

I've always been interested in animals. And when I was younger, it was a cross between wanting to work with animals with everyone you know, when you're young, all the adults will always tell me you're going to be a vet or something because that was the only ones that people think of working with animals. There was sort of limited options that people could think of. I knew I didn't want to be a vet at the time, but I wasn't sure what it was that I wanted to do. I actually wanted to work with animals, but I also was really into art. And creating. I think I was around 15 or 16 where I was getting quite obsessed with documentaries, wildlife documentaries. And I was thinking about doing about that. But I wasn't really sure to do it as a career. I did some photography classes, like extra classes in school we had like, extracurricular and that was really good. So getting involved with the camera. But still doing my degree was still also focused on thinking that I would maybe just work in conservation, conservation and studying in animals, doing fieldwork. And then it was only really sort of a year or so in a friend and I were both interested in filming. And so together, we sort of just decided to make a bit of a film. And I've yo yoed, after graduating between doing a bit of conservation work, and then trying to get into filmmaking, and then with a lot of is a lot of talking to people and trying to get experience. They got me in there. And eventually, it does take a long time. So yeah, I think like, definitely, I knew always knew that there was always elements that made me think of other things.

Student Interviewers 05:32

So obviously, when we were researching, looking at what you do and your history saw that you had a researchers job, why did you decide to go into filmmaking and not carry on with the research and that side of things?

Isabel Rogers 05:47

Whilst I was academic, I also really enjoyed variety in my work. And sometimes sticking some in academia, you can get variety, but there's can be really quite common that you end up getting quite focused on one subject, or one field that you become quite skilled and an expert in eventually, and just suited my personality to have more variety in what I do. And looking to different things. Conservation is also quite hard to get jobs in, it's also quite hard to get, like a sort of manage an income from a job in conservation, you need to do quite a lot further studies, often, I've got loads of friends from my degree who've done that, that they're having a great time and they're really building themselves up. Possibly ends up if you get more into those roles, they could sometimes become a little bit more desk work. And I knew that I was also really wanting to spend a lot of time in the field and not just being at a desk. So there's sort of that idea of once I've progressed in my career, I still want to have time in the field. And again, it was that desire to have that creative side as well. It wasn't just sort of, I really enjoyed a lot of my studies. But I found that doing the media, capturing images and doing stories about animals and the environment, fed into my other passion, of art and making. So you know, it's still something that I like I did a year out. During telly, I worked for a conservation NGO for a year, couple of years ago, I just needed a break from TV, tying it back. And conservation for a bit was really good. But yeah, they’re different world, but there are similarities. And it's nice to see where they crossover, but to see where they're different.

Student Interviewers 07:40

So to do the job you do now what sort of qualifications did you need to be able to do it?

Isabel Rogers 07:44

It's a bit varied. Generally they are say the majority of people who start in telly probably will have a degree, but not necessarily. If they do, it will be in a perhaps zoology or ecology or science background, but it also might be in film and television. But there are people who definitely didn't have a degree and have got experience by working, trying to get small level field assistant jobs or getting jobs in like kit houses, or getting jobs in, you're doing conservation field work, you can definitely do that without a degree, that's sort of a bit of a mixed bag. Generally is more common that people do have degrees, but it's not necessary. And then after that, it's just, I'd say when you're starting out, the majority of it is having a passion, but also having self motivation and getting up and doing things. So getting up and trying to make a film, trying to get experience of things which you can do by yourself. So you know, playing around with edit software things is much more about that once when you start and proving that you have a drive to learn and to do it, then actually the qualification so then once you're within a job, often a lot of the skills and the training can come within the job. I worked to the BBC for the start of my career. And they do a lot of training when you're there. So once you're in jobs, they will you will get offered training. So you get you know, first aid training to work in remote places. You might get training on cameras, you might get some training on edit software, then that kind of comes with the job and you can obviously have some influence as to what you want to know more about

Student Interviewers 09:38

When you were studying. How did you keep yourself motivated? Because I feel like a lot of people can't keep themselves motivated nowadays.

Isabel Rogers 09:45

Do you mean studying when I did my degree? 

Student Interviewers 09:47

Yeah, yeah. 

Isabel Rogers 09:49

Not sure really. I just I love the subjects and I think like you have to do something you really want to do. And obviously there are degrees which some, you think you possibly, you can do a degree to get you to somewhere afterwards. And that's totally valid. But I do feel like that you have to really enjoy and have a pull towards the subject to motivate yourself to go through it to do it. My degree was quite a small class, like there's probably only 30 or so of us. And so I think that helped because you felt quite like a family tribal and, and you had a much more like close connection with your lecturers and your and your supervisors. And I think that's another thing, it's actually really getting yourself involved, you can very easily just turn up to a lecture just as it starts and leave as soon as it ends. And then not doing anything extra. But actually maybe hang around after, if the supervisors up for having coffee with a group of you. Or they often they might need people supporting little projects they have, I feel like you putting yourself out there and getting more involved and being interested in doing extra reading and things actually makes you more motivated. When you show interest in something they will show interest in you. And that's what I've been finding engages you again, to have somebody sort of believe in you.

Student Interviewers 11:09

You said your classes were quite small, but was it like mainly male dominated, or whether they're a mix of both male or female?

Isabel Rogers 11:16

I would say mine was half and half actually. Yeah. So the degree was called Wildlife Conservation. It was in the Anthropology department, which is a little bit more unusual. Often they're more in the science departments, and so potentially having that might have skewed a little bit more female compared to some of the other like, a pure zoology degree. But I think, um, yeah, 50/50. And a real mix of ages, actually, and even nationalities

Student Interviewers 11:43

Did you feel as if the men in your class had more opportunities as you as that happens in some jobs and careers?

Isabel Rogers 11:50

I think in conservation, I didn't notice it very much in within the doing my degree, I think there's an element of confidence, which comes through, I think, particularly after school, I think once you get to university, I do feel like I didn't really feel a massive gender difference in how the opportunities were presented to us in university. I think definitely, within my career, I have noticed, like starting in television, I have noticed there being a difference in opportunities with gender, it’s not massive, and it's definitely getting a lot better. I think the majority of it's just the slightly more physical or technical aspects of some jobs that people don't assume that you can't do as a woman. But there's much more of a higher presumption that a man that similar level will, perhaps be more inclined to do that or have a natural affinity to do that. People are very happy to be proved wrong. It's almost like an innate thing that is just a cultural learning, as opposed to someone discriminating actively against women. I think that's almost requires a little bit more self confidence as a woman, put yourself out there and say, No, I can do that. And I'll show you, as opposed to maybe a male in the same position might not need such self confidence.

Student Interviewers 13:21

So within like your career, or like your school, like, was there ever a time where something didn't go, as you expected? And what did you learn from that experience?

Isabel Rogers 13:29

Certainly, after I graduated, it was very hard to get a job. I went back, I lived with my parents, and I did odd jobs for a while, you know, I got a quite a good 2:1, and I'd done extracurricular stuff. And I wasn't very confident interviewing. And I think, having done the degree, and then trying to get work afterwards, that was hard. And I think that was unexpected. I think potentially, I thought there might be a bit more career support, sort of from the university. But I think that's, maybe it's just one of those things that you can get lucky with or not. But I think that maybe surprised me and I wasn't expecting it. Like when I did finally start getting work. And I look back on that period. I think the one thing is, when you're younger, I think your perspective of time is a lot different. I think, actually, it wasn't very long that I was unemployed for and it wasn't a really a big deal. It wasn't that people would say, you know how long and obviously there is a financial implication of not having work, but I think being able to sort of relax and not worry too much about that is really important and just take that within your stride. So I definitely learnt that.

Student Interviewers 14:46

Do you feel as if in the future, you could move on to a different career with your degree or would you like to stick to the same one that you are doing now?

Isabel Rogers 14:54

That's a good question. I definitely would feel that at some point. I won't be doing the exact career that I'm in now, particularly the way that the world is going with climate change, and environmental issues. And I think it's really important that as much as it's good to have a skill set, it's good to also diversify your skill set and learn about other things. And I definitely, I'm keen to not become stuck in one path of the career, it takes me, you know, I can see people who are older than me, and more experienced than me, in positions which you normally you'd expect yourself to be aiming for in 5/10/15/20 years time. But actually, that's not really what I want. And I think I would, I think diversifying is important still, and that fulfils my interest is about love, having new things to learn. So it might be that I'm interested in moving more into sort of people documentaries, or it might be that I sort of leave telly totally for a bit or forever and end up working a little bit more on sort of practical things. But it's, it's kind of about keeping yourself open to opportunities. And rather than worrying about whether it's something that you in five years time or so… I think this is a job, which you it's good to have aspirations. And it's good to have ideas of what you want to be and do and achieve, particularly if you have somebody to motivate you. But it's also really good to just take things in stride. And things happen. quite short notice in this industry, you get job offers, and then they'll disappear, or you get a job offer and they want you to start in two weeks time. And then that's two years of your life taken up by that, It is very much having that sort of relaxed nature, just to like things will take you on a path where you can direct it and but it's also being able to be accepting of like opportunities.

Student Interviewers

So say somebody wanted to do like a career maybe similar to yours, or if they wanted to do something that you've already done, what sort of advice would you give them in starting that career?

Isabel Rogers 17:06

I would say doing as much homework effectively as you can, around the subjects and around… so reading, and there's incredible amount of learning opportunities available online now. But even before COVID, there was a good amount. And now after COVID, there's loads. I think not being afraid to talk to people is something, I think that held me back at the beginning, having a shyness and have in not being able to effectively have confidence in myself to say that I can do something that's really hard one, you know, to change in yourself, if you are someone who lacks confidence, but it's talking to your teachers about it as well or people around you who you might be inspired by even it was slightly different career. Talking them through sort of your ideas from days just helps you boost your confidence as what you can't do. Because you normally can do so much more than you think you can really. Things like doing your bits of your own homework, and trying to make your own films, even just, you can basically make famous films now on a smartphone. And what that shows is innovation, like motivation, and the ability just to get on and do something with what you have at your disposal. And if you made like a good film from your smartphone, you can share it around and use, you know, online platforms to put it up, then I think you're really in good stead for people being interested in you because they're prepared to, you don't need to know everything. But you need to have shown interest in learning about things and understanding and trying things out.

Student Interviewers 18:45

So talking about studying homework a minute ago, how did you balance your school life and your social life, while during your degree?

Isabel Rogers 18:55

Sometimes it was balanced, and sometimes it definitely wasn't balanced. I think first year you have the benefit of perhaps being a little bit easier, generally depends on the subjects and not counting towards your final mark at the end, I think you obviously can't fail it. So I think that does help people who are still finding their balance in the first year. That doesn't mean like an excuse to not study at all, but I think if you know, first year can sometimes be a learning curve for a lot of people because it's a different style of working. Then I needed to earn money. So I worked by generally as I worked throughout uni, you know, a couple of days a week. And then in the summer holidays, I had them off and I didn't really work very much in the summer. So I would kind of do it. You know, some people would just study throughout the year and then work all of the summer holidays. So it kind of depends on your preference of how you like to do that. I would rather have like a big chunk of time off, and I will try and get out and about doing some, like wildlife projects. And then I would work through uni. So I think that helped, because I'd have these two things that I needed that gave me structure like I had to attend work, you know, not be, you know, tired or and I had to do that a few times a week. And then I'd say that probably actually helped my studies, really. But I think it's also making sure you, you'll be friends with who you're friends with. Making sure that if you have friends who are also studious, or have interest in being studious is doing it with them often, especially second or third year. Me and my housemates would just go to library together and we'd motivate each other, like, okay, right today, at 10 o'clock, we're just gonna head to the library, we each other for lunch, and then we'll head home again. And like having that I think made a massive difference to, it's really easy to maybe you end up with people hanging out with people who don't do that, you will lose your motivation. Even though they're just different subjects that doesn’t matter.

Student Interviewers 21:04

What has been the most rewarding achievement for you so far, then?

Isabel Rogers 21:08

I guess. There's so many rewarding things that happened throughout. I worked on children's wildlife shows when in my earlier days, and I found them so rewarding because a Saturday telly that was aimed for kids to watch them in the Saturday morning, and then motivate them to go out and do something outdoors. Either activity sport wise or like for wildlife the rest of the weekend. And that was really rewarding because we would ask the kids to then write into us or email in what they did after watching the show. And I found that really rewarding because you often when you put something out on telly, it's it goes out maybe a few people watch it, and then everyone then that's kind of it. And you might be a year two or sometimes three years of your life for like an hour on telly. So I think it's really nice, really nice to have those tangible results where you feel like you're making a difference. We got an award, I can't remember what it was now for one I worked on a couple of years ago, we had a really women strong team. And we had quite a number of articles written about how it was, I think maybe at the time, it was somewhat unusual that we would have majority of women producing and making this series called Animals With Cameras. And so that felt really rewarding to be involved in a production there where we had these incredibly talented and skilled women not only involved in the making, but leading the making of the films, the series, that was very well rewarding, I think to be part of that. And it's definitely rewarding to work with other women in these roles, and you can kind of yeah, then you find inspiration through them.

Student Interviewers 22:56

Talking about your experiences, we've seen that you've travelled a lot during your career. What are some of the things that you felt were different in your career over in different countries compared to what you do over here with it?

Isabel Rogers 23:08

Yeah, so when I travel, what happens is in the production and the office in the UK, we will research, we will come up with the story, we'll come up with the locations of where we'd film it. We contact experts, and we start planning the kit and the crew to film a certain sequence. So they you have you want to film, I don't know bears hunting caribou. So you have to talk to lots of people find out locations, work out the logistics of how you get people there, what kind of cameras and lenses you need to film that because the distances etc. And then when you get out there, you… so that I've spent a lot of the last few years in the USA. And when you're on location with. So what happens is I'm on location, I'm a director and I have camera crew, and camera assistants working. We work as a team to try and film that subject. And so my role changes when I'm out there. You know, I've got everything prepped by now everything should be ready. And so then I'm almost triple roll on locations, kind of troubleshooting and keeping the camera crew happy. But it's also keeping them on target with what it is that we need. making any adjustments with what shot we want, to say we've had loads of shots now of baby caribou, we don't need any more. That my decision often to make. So it's quite nice to have a role change. Yeah, so that's how it normally works in work abroad. It's like a different role that I do. And I would normally be out in the field for long, long hours during the day, reviewing stuff in the evening often, but it's a very different sort of daily routine compared to when I'm in the back in the UK in the office.

Student Interviewers 25:02

So what are some of the interesting things you've experienced in other countries, some of the amazing things that you've seen?

Isabel Rogers 25:09

Last year was amazing, actually opportunity, we got to see one of the biggest salmon runs in the world, which is the salmon return from the ocean, and they run up the rivers to where they were spawned, they spawn first, they were born. And they will they do that in a mass migration. And they, they're these species of bright red. So you've got these incredible images of 1000s of 1000s of red salmon, travelling up these clear blue ribbons in Alaska. And then they spawn when they get to where they need to get to. So that was an incredible place incredible location, feel really privileged to see such an amazing migration. But even actually, like, one of the most enjoyable things I filmed was just we filmed some young, seven, eight year olds, badger watching, just in the UK, and it's not exotic, and it's not far away. And people do see badges every so often. But I think it was that really special. You've been waiting hours and hours in the dark with fidgety eight year olds, who just want their dinner and there's suddenly the badges come out. And it's really a reward. That was very magical. So I think you know, you can find like, rewarding experiences, you don't always have to be 1000s of miles away from home.

Student Interviewers 26:26

What's the process like? So it's like you filmed it? What sort of things do you have to do afterwards to make sure you've got everything that you need to put onto like the documentaries and stuff?

Isabel Rogers 26:35

No, that's a good question. So we come back from the shoot, we have hard drives full of footage. Hopefully, we would have had time to look through some of it, whilst we're on vacation to know roughly what it is. That comes back to the UK. And we have talented people called Edit Assistants who work in the digital imaging technician roles, and they will process that footage, they back it up a load of time, so you will never lose it. They process it because it's often very, very large in size, you're talking, we film in 8k at the moment and they make it viewable on the system. Then someone on the team will then be able to view that and edit software. And they go through every single clip that was filmed. And they log it. So they sort of decide the quality of the shot: that was really good, all right, or quite bad. And then they also start pulling together behaviours, or, depending on your story, you make little like folders and you can start dropping them in. And then you can start. Once you get to that stage, you bring in an editor who is someone who's technically skilled, but also the really good story, like someone who's really good at telling stories, and they will sit with your producer or myself. And using your script as to what your story is, once you filmed everything, you start cutting that together. So they'll start pulling in the clips based on your what you've already logged. And then if there are holes, there's archive, there is number of websites, where you can get archive footage from which you buy in stock, or you contact other productions. So you can contact the BBC, maybe they shot something five years ago, a whale, and you need a particular shot that you didn't get on location, you can buy that in. Or you licence it. So that's another job. And then it goes through a number of like reviews from seeing the people when you go back and forth a load of times. Sometimes the stories change a bit. And they get music added. And then someone will record the commentary. And they do sound effects as well. So someone often has a big library of sound effects and adds that in so does call something called grading which is you don't one goes through really carefully adjusting the colour of all the clips to make sure it works together and you haven't got the highlights aren't to highlight in the dark fun, too dark and so yeah, there's quite a long process once you come back.

Student Interviewers 29:18

How long do you reckon the production takes?

Isabel Rogers 29:22

Well it really depends, like I've made films in six months. Like from start to finish you can make a series you can shoot you know 20 minutes of telly in a couple of days if you do more people and so that's possible but also the last one I've done you know we've made an hour episode and it's taking us two years. It really depends and there's a lot of variation depending on the money depending on where it's going and your subjects.

Student Interviewers 29:52

That’s really really interesting cos you don’t think it takes that long. Like if you think it's like an hour you don't you think you'll only take like a couple of weeks.

Isabel Rogers 30:00

You know when they involve more people they're very quick. But if you have to sit and wait for a particular behaviour or you've got like, one opportunity a year because it's, you know, a seasonal behaviour, then yeah, these things then they add up.

Student Interviewers 30:15

Yeah, that's been amazing talking to you and figuring out how you do things. Very informative. And it's been quite interesting as well. Yeah. It really does inspire you in how you do it.

Isabel Rogers 30:25

Thank you. I really hope you guys like, yeah, find out what it is that you want to do. But I just don't worry about having too good an idea. Do what you enjoy and what you you feel that you have some skill in as well. And you can I think the world is so different now that you can change and you can always pull up pick up skills and training all the time.

Outro 30:48

Thank you for joining another STEM Untapped podcast. If you enjoyed this episode, then subscribe for free on your podcast app. You can follow us on Instagram @stemuntapped. If you know of a school or group of students who would like to interview female or non-binary role models do get in touch. Likewise, if you know of anyone who would be a great STEM role model, do let us know. Our details are all documented in the show notes.